Note: I have written then ages ago but did not post it here for some odd reason. It is in three parts as posted on a forum.
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I am a member of the London Victorian Strollers and we will be attending an event in London this December. I would be wearing morning dress but I do not have a proper self-tie Ascot tie (i.e. not a day cravat or the pre-tied nonsense!) that would be fitting for the period. Thus, I decided to make myself one as I obviously could not pop down to the shops to buy one or fork out a few hundred to have one specially made.
I searched the net to look for photos of examples as well as find the pattern and dimensions. After I made the pattern I bought the fabric. Since I could not find a place where they sell necktie silk, I decided to harvest the silk of two neckties which would be cheaper. I also got some interfacing and some backing silk.
I took the ties apart and then ironed them flat. Then I cut the two pieces at the point where they would join together to form one single piece. I made sure I cut it diagonally and that the pattern would run smoothly to as to be unnoticable that it is two separate pieces. Then I sewn them together and ironed the joint flat.
Using the template, I marked the outline with chalk and cut out the silk and interfacing. I sandwiched the layers together: backing, pattern silk (with the design facing downwards) and then interfacing. The edges are then basted together then run under the machine to seal all the edges but a gap at one end. Edges are then trimmed neatly, corners snipped, then the whole thing is turned inside out and then ironed flat.
The ends of the paddles are sewn together so they would form a triangular point and then they are hand stitched in place.
The end result:
The dimensions are 52″ x 4 1/2″. The neckband is 1″ wide and 15″ (my collar size) long.
Of course, photos of me wearing it would be taken shortly…
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It really is pretty straight forward matching the patterns of the two pieces together. As said, one tie isn’t sufficent enough as one end is not wide enough. You need to harvest two ties that are the same. I popped into M&S and got them for £15 each (they were the only design I thought appropriate). The backing silk was around £6 half a metre and £1.50 for the interfacing. The first interfacing I bought was too thick so I had to get a thinner medium weight one so it doesn’t come out stiff.
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As promised, photos of me wearing it:
I used this method to tie it:
I’m still trying to perfect the tying method but the trick is to not rush it or pull too tight otherwise you will not get the barrel knot and instead have a pathetic little knot which does not look good. Done properly, the length of each end should be equal. The Ascot pin can be pushed through the knot or through both paddles as they cross each other (as I have done) and maybe through the shirt (and capped off) to secure it in place and push it up a little.
As to dimensions:
a = total length in relation to width of paddles
b = neckband size (this should be the same as that of a sized bow tie, thus a 15″ stiff collar requires 15 1/2″ neckband)
c = 5 1/4″
e = diamond end length in relation to width of paddles
f = width in relation to total length
g = 1/2″ to 1″
Dimensions relations are (a x f):
52″ x 4 1/2″
50″ x 4″
48″ x 3 1/2″
46″ x 3″
Thus, if a and f are 52″ and 4 1/2″ respectively and b is 15″, e is 2 1/4″. g should be 1″ if the paddles are the thickest and be thinner if the paddles are thinner. Note that the thinnest is 3/4″; any thinner and you will have difficulty turning the whole thing inside out (you would have to hand sew the edges the right way out if so) and also it looks skimpy and pre-tied.
Note that the ends are square and folded into the middle and sewn down to form diamond points (as can be seen in the Ascot tie tying method) but they can also be left squared.
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Here is another image of me wearing the Ascot in full morning dress. The knot is tied better now as I have had practice.
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Addendum
Here is a photo of one made by Messrs. Andrews & Pygott who used this very guide to make one themselves:
The knot is perfectly tied.
The pattern isn’t what I would choose but it most certainly works! Note that the silk pattern wouldn’t be the same as what you would choose for a wedding necktie (e.g. houndstooth, etc) as the way the pattern would lie is different.
7th August 2011
This is actually amazing! Will definitely try it at some stage.
Oh do. It is actually pretty straightforward to make. Just make sure you source a good formal silk to do it and it would look amazing.
[…] said in the past we were going to do it. THIS GUIDE by Charles Rupert Domeki has been tempting us for a long time, but you know how hard it is to get […]
Through this site’s wonderful guidance I’ve obtained a cracking shirt with which i shall be wearing Morning Dress at a wedding in a few weeks’ time.
http://www.moss.co.uk/catalogue/963628191.html
I plan on wearing a straight (neck) tie it will be a blue and white stripe that matches that of the groom’s decided colour scheme. A little guidance on the knot would be welcomed… Can’t really decide bewteen a four-in-hand or a half-windsor.
The tie is silk and not too thick material. I have a chunky neck, and my only concern is whether the HW would be considered gauche? If so, I will plump for the FIH. Any advice?
You’re looking too much into the knot of the tie. It is not really important which knot you use in the whole scheme of things. IMHO, you can’t go wrong with a FIH.
[…] Ascots or formal cravats were once de rigueur for formal dress (frock coat and morning dress) but since the Edwardian period has fallen out of use and in its place the necktie is worn. However, Ascots were to certain degrees still retained by some people. Unfortunately in recent years, the Ascot was further downgraded due to the hire wear companies producing Ascots of the wrong pattern (i.e. the pattern for an informal day cravat which is meant to be worn under the open collar of a shirt and has a pleated rather than plain neckband) and of the clip-on variety. This coupled with an attached wing collar that is floppy and unsubstantial as a proper stiff starched detachable one created a very sloppy and inelegant look. Since this look was done so badly and to death, Gentlemen began to edge away swiftly from wearing the Ascot. Nowadays, no one but a handful of tailors, including myself, actually know what the correct pattern an Ascot ought to be and the correct way to tie one. […]
[…] Wolfenbloode, honored member of the London Victorian Strollers worked up this ascot tutorial for a dignified and chic ascot, and Messrs. Andrews and Pygott (with the assistance of their cat, […]
I just used your pattern and it worked perfectly. Thank you!
Thanks, this is very useful. I shall be doing this for my wedding in the summer. Could you please give a bit information about the type of shirt to wear with this? do I just use a normal wingtip shirt? I will be in a morning dress.
A plain wing collar shirt (not one with a bib at the front), preferably high and of the stiff detachable kind.
Dear Sir,
After searching for many hours online for a proper ascot, I give up and will make one myself using your fine tutorial. Luckily, I am experienced in sewing.
However, two questions remain:
-what kind of interfacing is the best?
– can you give some more details on how to turn the ascot outside-in, apparently it is possible to pull the wide parts through the small neckband part?
Much obliged,
Sebastiaan.
You can use any sort of interfacing (cotton, linen, etc) as long as it is soft and not too rigid. You could turn out via an opening in the small neckband but this depends on the thickness of the silk and interfacing combined. If you’re using a printed silk then it would be easy, if a thick woven one then you might struggle a bit. Use a thin stick or cane with a smooth head to do the pushing through.
I’m going to use this pattern to make an ascot of my own for a cosplay I’m doing. I’m using cotton since it’s a cheap fabric that will still look good with the cosplay and is probably better for a first-timer like me. My question is in regards to the patterning: when all measurements have been transferred to the pattern paper, should I add some extra fabric to each edge to do the actual sewing on, or do the example measurements you provided already include the sewing edge?
The draft I described above doesn’t include a seam allowance so you should add that in.
Thank you!
Thank you for publishing this guide. Your schematic with dimensions was particularly clear and helpful. As I had found the neckband of cravats I already owned to be annoyingly wide, I made mine 3/4″ in width. As you say, any narrower and it would have been impractical to turn the cravat right way out after stitching (machine stitched all the way round apart from a few inches on one side of the middle of the neckband). The diagram for tying it was also interesting – I used the same material for both faces so in my case it doesn’t matter much, but my previous method (making the loop in the working end first rather than folding over the other end with the working end still raised) did not naturally allow the paddles to fold over and fall with the patterned face outwards.